The Future of AI: Investing, Jobs & Human Connection | Marina Davidova, DVC

At some point of time, I lost myself completely. Loneliness, it's a big problem right now.

Too many things are being blamed on AI right now. For example, layoffs. That happened to the US economy when a lot of industries have been moved to China. The problem is human behavior is adapting slowly.

Today's conversation is going to be a bit of a mixed salad. We'll talk about AI, investing, ambition, family, loneliness, meaning, and the very human question of how to build a life that actually feels like yours. And my wonderful guest, Marina. Marina, welcome. Thank you so much for inviting me. And I really believe that like all these topics are super important, but we are here today because we really need human connections and most of the things will be about like humans.

Yes. And but the very first question that I really want to ask you is like Marina, you run an investment fund focused on AI companies. How do you tell when you're looking at just not just another AI startup, but something you generally want to believe in? We have to start like a little bit early. We've been investing in AI for the last 11 years. That's our focus. We started doing this when it was just moonshot with little applications to the real world. it was 2014, 2015. There there were already some implications in computer vision or advertisement, but not so much. Most of the things were like too early. But we've already seen how the technology can change everything, every industry, and every life. That's fascinating and actually that's a lot of responsibility. So, when we were thinking about it, we decided that we really want to participate in this like technology revolution.

And the best way to do this is to invest in early stage because in this phase, you can work closely not only with technology, but also with people. You can bet on founders. You can see their real motivation. What really drives them. This is what we are doing right now. We have a fund which is based on community. Most of the things we discussed a lot internally with group of angels and group of our LPs. And most of our discussions again, not about technology because like living in Silicon Valley right now, we definitely can understand that every day can bring something new that will change everything that you built yesterday. But the only thing that can stay is people. So you're betting on people. So we are discussing a lot people, people like team dynamics, long long short motivation and other stuff. You recently said that too many things are being blamed on AI right now.

For example, layoffs. How do you see it yourself? Is AI truly already taking people's job or companies like sometimes using it as a convenient explain explanation for decision they are were going to make anyway. That's very dangerous topic to discuss because like we've seen a lot of inefficiencies everywhere. Like even if you talk about politics, we can see how lots of like how lots of money is are spent on not on efficient decisions, not on like very operational like very not effective things. in in the world, if you if you think about this, communism actually can be very effective strategy where everything is transparent when you have all information and you can make decision base based on on information that I for everyone. Mhm. In real world, it's it was not accessible. Mhm. But the AI can actually do this. First of all, I believe that as a humanity we we we brought a lot of problems to the world that could could not be saved could not be solved without AI right now.

That's the first thing. Another thing that we can do a lot of things more efficient, more economically effective. But again, it takes time and the only one stopper for that is human behavior because it's not a problem for technology to adapt right now. The problem is human behavior is adapting slowly. So, we are changing our habits slowly. We are changing our approach slowly. That's why we can see right now a lot of like frustration, a lot of misunderstanding and a lot of like frustration about tomorrow. But I as a venture capitalist, I'm optimist. I should be optimistic.

and I believe that's the pace as a as a humanity we can pass. But if we will talk about current days, like nowadays, does all do this all these layoffs are connected to

to AI or usually it's just something that company, for example, wanted to do anyway, but they decided that they will say to their investors, I don't know, to clients that we're laying off these people because we have very efficient AI tools right now. So, we don't need them anymore. That's very complex question because like first of all we always had layoffs in big corporations. Like for example, if you take Snap, they always have this KPI every year to have like 10% of layoffs. That's a strategy. I see hummingbird right right right behind the the window right now. It's very cute.

Yeah. So, Snap for example always had this KPI. I know this internally that like they have like 10% of layoffs every year. That was a normal thing. Now, like if they're doing layoffs, this even the same amount, all media is saying like it's it's all about AI. They're laying off people because they we don't need them anymore, which is not like 100% true. so, that's the first thing. Another thing of course when we do have economically unstable situation and like everyone is expecting bigger smaller correction on the market due to AI, companies want to be prepared. And the first thing, yes, we can definitely see benefits of using AI. And if we can look closely, the first like wave was okay, we can lay off all junior engineers from the companies because we don't need them anymore. We have analysts, cursor, and other white coding tools.

But if you can see later, companies are staying starting to hire more and more personnel now because they realize that like it's not enough. You can do more with with this like tools and instruments, but we still do need people. We had a wonderful discussion last weekend on a industry I'm not an expert at all. That was a discussion about a filmmaking industry. Lots of people in filmmaking industry are very afraid of that they will be replaced by AI. AI can do lots of things right now. We forgot that the the human beings are creators. They are not They're not robots. They are They can do a routine stuff. But first of all, they're creators. And to create things, we can do it with AI and with better. Do you think that it's something that we just haven't been seeing before as a generation here in in Silicon Valley or it's something new that came with AI?

You know, we just had absolutely the same discussion recently that happened to the US economy when a lot of industries have have been moved to China and other like developed countries. Like mass production, other stuff. So lots of people actually lost their job. And at that time, it was even more crucial because like you your whole life was very certain. You have one degree, you work for the same job all life and people have been laid off and they couldn't find any job because they just could not adapt to this. And they could they have not been used to they they were not flexible, they could not be they they couldn't understand that they have to set like have different skills, they have to study again, they have to try something else. So for my many families, that was a disaster. Now we can see it like applied to many industries, not just for manufacturing industries, but for many industries on a bigger scale.

But the difference now in comparison like with 40 years ago is that people have access to more information, they have access to knowledge, and they have understanding that they have to be flexible. For some of them would be difficult for them less difficult. And I hope that this this changing period would be faster. So for them it was just their life. It's changed forever and most of them could not adapt. For many people now I hope it's like with the help of of the community people around and the government it would be less painful, but it's still a lot of process and it's still Well, I really want to see efforts from all of the sides. For example, you mentioned that recent students that out of the college they cannot find a job. And I've seen the statistics that around 80% people really for the first year they cannot find anything.

Which is like awful. They spend four, five, six years like trying to get this degree, like getting this knowledge, getting these skills that are not needed anymore. Yeah, and they aren't prepared for that. That's the They have this young mindset that they should be motivated doing career and now they receive this huge blocker in the very beginning. Yeah, when you don't have this confidence so they don't

been huge amount of money for the outdated knowledge information and outdated processes that colleges have and it's and it's very difficult actually to apply for colleges right now as well. I already seen some of the efforts. I hope it will be more. I know that like for example on the recent that in Vancouver they announced their initiative 10 10 Academy 10 Academy.org something like that. Where they ask companies, big corporations, to be involved in the process, so they can set, and they can set requirements who they want to see at their like, junior jobs. Mhm. so like, all in collaboration with universities, colleges, and corporations, we can finally see, that students after the college can find a job. So, we cannot move like, alone in this process. Everyone should be involved.

Yeah, and I think that is a great initiative, and I hope that, companies also will see this vision, will have this vision, who do they need actually right now, because probably everyone is in some kind of, transformation, and companies are also frustrated. Yeah, like, how their processes will look like in Oh, yeah, that's yeah. It's very hard like, if if you're for the whole like, companies, corporation life, you, you try to, like, your unit economics worked pretty well, and now you have to change, and you don't know how. Yeah, they have a lot of frustration as well. So, that's that's a very tough time, but at the same time, it's a lot of opportunities for everyone. It feels like AI has become strategically, strangely toxic topic in the media. on one side, there is toxic negativity driven entirely by fear of loss and disruption. On the other, toxic optimism built on fantasies and limitless progress, a world without diseases, and a future free of like boring, difficult work.

Where do you place yourself in this spectrum? As you said previously, you're more like an optimist.

Yeah, well, you know, I think the truth is some somewhere in the middle. because like actually everything here is also driven by humanity, and human beings are not bad or good. They are different, and they have We all have different angles and all different motivations. So, the truth is somewhere in the middle. I professionally is optimist. I believe in technology, and I believe in humanity as well. So, I believe that together in collaboration and with right processes, we don't have right processes right now. We don't have right alignment right now. But I really hope that like institutions that we have in the country will help us to build these guardrails for more optimistic view on how and what technology can do. Need tech talent fast? At KeyPeople, we connect companies in the US and Europe with elite tech experts from Latin America and the EU.

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And what do you think AI won't replace in a like nearest future? Yeah, human interactions. We discussed it with the other GPs from like very well-known firms that right now most of the processes are automated. Like all AI agents can write like investment demos pretty good, like much better than GPs can do. But what cannot be replaced is human connection. Mhm. In all all ways. in communication, in I don't know, in in teaching, even in teaching. So, for example, our son next year, he we are planning that he will join Alpha School where most of the like teaching would be done by AI. So, they like compressed all of the usual school knowledge just in 2 hours and building like individual tracks that you can do on a computer like with AI teacher. But at the same time, after that, they have project-based learnings with people, with guides, with other kids.

And it will take more time. So, 2 hours for usual what kids usually do at school.

Theory. Like, yeah. Yeah. And all other time is for connection, for building something together, for project-based, different things. Which is awesome. I really hope hope so that it's going to stay like that because I've heard one interesting opinion that if we talk about social media, they replaced our dopamine. Yeah, so they've became our dopamine addictive tools with this like short videos and short spikes of dopamine that replaces our real-life dopamine. I've heard an interesting topic that chatbots, they can actually replace our ox oxytocin. Because people, they build such a strong connection with this AI chatbots, especially young kids, like teenagers. It's also can be some kind of a replacement of a connection. What Do What do you think about it?

Well, maybe I'm too optimistic. I don't know. So, first of all, we are trying to judge how the relationship and connection will look like for a younger generation, but we have zero experience living in the world of AI and in the world of chatbots. and trying to, like, apply our knowledge and our, like, I know, childhood experience to absolutely different setup. So, I talk we have a we have two kids. We have a teenager, she's, almost 16 and we have 8 years old. So, our daughter, already lives in the world, where AI is a normal thing, where, for example, on a Snap, you have, like, My AI. So, this, like, AI friend with whom she chat from time to time. And we actually had a very interesting discussion. Ask her, like, what what what does she think about it? And she said, like, I understand this is AI, this is not a not, like, a a person, but I like that I can I can talk to this AI friend.

Maybe it's sometimes I I have, like, a lot of feelings. I'm I can't talk to my friends, but it it can leave some, I know, scars into our relationship. I But actually, I need to steam I actually steam I steam out. I I But it's a from time to time we all have it. And she really appreciate this as a tool and as an instrument. So, this is an absolutely different world. What I like a lot in this, like, what is going on around us right now, social media have like advantages and disadvantages. And of course, it like it brought a lot of connection at the same time it polarized us and it brought a lot of loneliness at the same time. And, we can see a lot of, like, I know, depression symptoms when people are starting, like, spending a lot of time on browsing, like, looking at a lot of reels, like, trying to earn this, like, a cheap dopamine.

Mhm. But we never know so much about how our brain brains work, about all this oxytocin, dopamine. Now we are so much more aware of what is going on inside our brains and inside our like system that we can actually use this knowledge to to be better. So for me, when I like okay, when I realized that and actually we even invest in the company, it it called help rhythms. They can measure level of cyclothymia and depression by the by the way you are interacting with your phone, how many times you use it, how like like the way you are doing this, like how are you spending time on this. Now we have so much information and understanding about all of this, so we can effectively implement, I don't know, use screen times and now now that this is a cheap dopamine and why not doing this like a do dopamine free weekends to help our system to be more productive, efficient and cope with all stress around.

Got it. You're really an optimist.

I thought that I'm an but you're oh you're a winner. Yeah, so a lot of people worry that AI is making products and services worse, more generic, more soulless and that is taking away the joy from things they generally love doing. For example, I would share my own experience. I used to love writing LinkedIn posts, engaging with good people and reading what others had to say. Now so much of that feels devaluated because many posts are almost entirely written by AI and have become boring to read. The same is true for comments. it now makes much more effort to find a real human being behind all the generated text. What do you think about this? So, this all of this like creative content, doesn't matter like music, writing, and other stuff. There's like lots of, lots of ways. I had very interesting, surrealistic experience, when I, attended the opening of, contemporary art museum in San Francisco.

I, I came there after two like AI conferences, and I was feeling like I finally something not about AI, something we probably could talk about art or something else. You know what? Like it was a panel of six people from absolute different industries, from music, from art, from there was there was a writer, a famous writer, and they were all talking about AI. They were all afraid that like what's next for them, because they were all afraid like if they spent all their lives trying to do their job, and they were doing it perfectly, and now they they're afraid that they could be lost in all this like overwhelming amount of like AI-generated stuff. But, it's not the first time actually happening when, we went online, we've seen the huge amount like new like content that was like that been digitalized and like But, still the amount the proportion of like the good ones but exactly the same as before.

So, yes, now we have more, and it's like it's really overwhelming to see all this content. But, the good content is still like the same proportion of what like in from all of the amount. But, I feel you. I started to use less, LinkedIn, and had walk through all of this absolutely the same comments generated by AI. But, like it it will lead to new instruments and new ways of communicating because like when everyone will stop using it, people will need and other places to express. and I can actually feel that like on maybe that's my like subjective personal feeling that X right now is even more, in demand than LinkedIn because like expressing shortly your point of view without always like, I don't know, water. is more in demand. I'm not a huge user of X, but, I don't know if they have like better filtration of AI comments and AI writers.

But actually I'm I'm So, this is topic I'm I'm I'm not an expert here, but I'm actually excited to I don't have to talk about this, to brainstorm. Maybe like people will have their opinions in the comments because I see, for example, how young generation, are connecting. They are not deeply involved in like like big, social media, Instagram, LinkedIn, but they form a lot of groups and all these groups they are talking a lot. So, probably maybe that's would be the future. Like having like small groups for discussions. I don't know where is like different filters to be, involved in it. I don't know. Yeah, they It will be something new. It will lead to new form of communication.

When there is so much AI FOMO all around us, how do you stay clear-headed and avoid seeing everything through the eyes of the crowd? That's a beauty like living in Silicon Valley. At some point of time you just accept that you cannot, cope with everything, and you will always have this FOMO of like a fear of missing out of like some valuable information. So, for me is just like I'm I realized that in order to cope with everything that is going on, I have to work a lot on myself, not on like information I I'm I'm getting access to, but like how to make your brain and your body productive to actually be capable to accept this information. You know, like now, reading all these like new technology stuff, like trying all these new agents and all these like new things, it would can take all of your time.

Can take all of your your time, time that you like usually spend with your family, with your friends, every time, everything. I've seen lots of my friends on this like white coding loop when they are like constantly not sleeping like doing another prompt, doing something new like looking forward to see the result and again and again like sleepless night. So, this is not a healthy thing. And at some point of time I just stopped, very strictly look at my schedule. When I prioritize, very like generic things like, okay, I have I should have enough enough time to sleep, I should have enough time to spend with my family and friends, I should have enough time for, I don't know, sports, fresh air and good nutrition. Mhm. And everything else I can spend on productively, on learning, on trying, on developing like things we also now we're not only investing in in in a we're also developing our own AI agents in the fund.

So, yeah, like you know, to do all of this, like first you have to put a mask on yourself. Yeah. Then I'm trying to understand what is going on in the world. It's a very interesting point of view on this question. Like yesterday, we talked with my husband that live coding and working in AI chatbot seems like a gambling a bit because you don't know what's going to be what kind of answer will you receive and you hope that it's going to be a great answer, but not that great. I need to just a small thing. I just will I will correct this small thing and you're like you're in. You're you're spending like hours there and Hours, money, tokens, everything. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. I thought that the gambling will be stopped on scrolling the Instagram scroll feed, yeah, because it's also kind of a gambling.

You like something, you hope that the next thing is going to be as fun and interesting as the previous one, but the next one is like, "Oh, no. I need to scroll more because that was real it really sucks."

It's like, "What do they think about me when they show me this kind of content?" I have like almost the very last question about AI. People you used to talk now that

you will be replaced with another person that knows how to do your job with AI and the using AI is an actual skill that you need to build and that's going to make your future proof with your like your CV future proof. And I was thinking, "What kind of AI skill? What kind of What are we talking about?" I mean, what does it mean for you to be AI skilled?

That's an amazing question. But like talking back to your previous question, I want to add that people are very different and people actually digest information differently. So, for us for me, for example, I learn a lot from other people and that's why we build our plan on based on community. We have a lot of like people who are real experts in the field from rubber robotics to I don't know, like infrastructure and other stuff. So, we talk a lot to our LPs and our founders and that's also our way of learning. I think that when when we talked a lot in the community about that, the main thing is actually to write a right prompt. And prompt is not about like, okay, I I will explain what I want to do. It's actually see a bigger picture. To see a bigger picture, you have to understand like like the mechanics of how what is working, how it's working and that's why I don't know, like I have a friend who is a like professional stand-up comedian, Julia.

Mhm. And we were discussing like everyone can ask ChatGPT or I don't know, Anthropic to you write a script, like stand-up script. Would it be funny? No, because like it's way more difficult to write an like to set up a right prompt to get an actual good result. And you have to have always like 10 years of experience to in order to do this. Or we discuss it with famous filmmaker, Timur Bekmambetov. Now he's building an orchestration layer of agents for filmmaking industry. To make everyone can do a video right now using, for example, our portfolio company Higgsfield or like I don't know, lots of other available tools. Would it be a good video? most of these videos are not that good. Especially if you're talking about like bigger movies, like when you have to set up like characters setups, like big scenes. You cannot write a prompt saying like, "Okay, you you you should like the the main character should go to the window, looks I don't know, sad, tears should come from his eye."

It would be a very boring bad movie. So, in order to do this, you have to understand on a deeper level of emotions what is going on with a character in order to write a like good prompt. So, I think the like to be AI native, you have to have a lot of like different experience that usually human beings have.

Before, you should be educated, you should have some specific experience.

Students expertise and experience in the field in order to write write prompt to get the right result. To get the very efficient result. As I understand that AI skill, it means that you're bringing some kind of a curiosity and your general technology usage to your original professional profile, yeah? You have to be very open to try different things because like every day is something new. So, you have to be very adaptable to it. Language is now like before that like engineers were kings because they learned how to code. Now, language is a universal tool to build things, to create things. And language actually brought us to where we are because like we evolved as a humanity from tribes to where we are because we have language. We can talk. We can build tribes together and we can build a lot of things together. So, now like using this language properly with your experience with understanding like with adaptability with understanding that like technology is is is your partner and it can change quickly and you are okay to to that can can make you AI native.

I hope that it's going to be like just like that and

so Marina, you run an AI investment fund, work on fascinating projects, speak publicly, have a beautiful family, look amazing, and still make time for creativity. From the outside, you seem like an example of a successful woman. But how do you define success for yourself? I do believe in balance, but for me balance is not like okay like I have this set of things I have to do. I prioritize prioritize some of them. So for example I I spend like 50% time on the fund like and 30% on the family, 20% something else. This is not like that. Balance for me, and I think most of people agree with me because we have to combine a lot of like roles and a lot of hats. For me balance is like a balance board. Have you tried balance board? It's a thing when you like always trying to like stay, but it's always like you're leaning to one side or another side.

So the trick is to be on the board and not to fall from it. But you always always like trying to lean to one one things or another thing. So for some time you're focusing on one thing, another time you're focusing on another thing. You are trying to be safe so you have all these like helmets and other stuff to protect yourself. Yes. So for me life is like this and to be successful is to be on this balance board with like focus on one on another thing from time to time. Sometimes more on family, sometimes more on on a fun, sometimes on on other side projects, and be safe. And be safe. And safety for me is done by, I would say, so there's like three things that motivate myself on a long term. The The first one is like foundational layer layer. You cannot be on this balance board without building properly foundational layer.

Foundational layer is something like that works for you, and it could be different for like everyone, but for me it's like if you I don't have time in my schedule for, I don't know, even small workout in the morning, I know that the level of my energy will drop at some point of time. Mhm. If I don't have time to properly eat or like spend time with my family, I can do it for some time, but on a long term it will not work. So foundational layer is like pillars that work for you. Mhm. So you can consistently do like a lot of things. Mhm. And on top of that, like there should be always something that can motivate me on a long distance. It's like some goal or like our brain has different like like different system for motivation. Like sometimes it's like for m- motivation right here, right now.

It's joy in the moment. So for example, I know I do something and then I will go for a walk and it will bring me happiness. and there's like long-term happiness, which involves like getting some knowledge or achieving some like very hard goal. So I'm always trying to have like small joy happiness in the moment and long-term goals or like knowledge knowledge learning goals that I can achieve. So, that's like that keep me on on my balance board. Wow, thank you for sharing. It's really interesting that the main thing that you highlighted is like balance and safety. Yeah, and it seems like the world right now is the opposite, yeah? So, you need to do like a lot of job, yeah? To keep balancing and to feel this internal safety and peace. I agree and I've heard that from my yoga teacher that there is no balance.

There is only balancing. Dare to say that you're an ambitious person and you have a lot of goals, you have a lot of plans and deeply driven person, too. Where do you think that comes from and what continues to sustain it?

it's a personality trait. And I think it was I was always like I was always very ambitious. I even as a child I really like to try new things and if if I saw a new class, a dancing class or theater classes, French class, I would immediately sign myself up for the class. I think I I was very happy and I'm very grateful to my parents and my environment who always support me in this. So, when you're ambitious and you're supported by your family, like this like brings very important loop is working pretty good. So, like further in life every time when I was setting like ambitious goals, it helped me a lot. But, there is a there is a caveat to it. I think and maybe you can you can you can share it like the the similar thing feelings with me. When we had childhood in very uncertain time and not very like safe environment, you always try to be better to control a lot of things and to set very big goals just to like just to have this like feelings that you can survive.

From like I think for like most of Russian speaking people, ambitious strategy is a survival mode. Do you see any downsides of ambition? You are always stressed because it's always not enough. Like how our brains work in this you can achieve a very hard goal. You can won an Olympic gold, for example. But and you will be very happy for some point of time. But you have expectation from yourself and people around you have expectation from you as well. No, on the next Olympics you will earn this gold medal again. And even if you do you won't feel the same happiness at the first one. So there's always like constant constant moving in trying to reach this like copies like these ambitions ambitions and like feeling this happiness from reaching it. And it's it's never-ending game and only one way to actually cope with it is to have this like to add to this and it's a it's a it's a good like motivation strategy but it it will not bring you happiness unless you will feed it with like daily happiness moment like present goals like okay, where am I right now?

Like can are you present right now? Can you feel what is going on outside? Can you feel that actually we are in California, the sun is shining and we can enjoy life even if it's hard. I remember when I'm we were we had very hard time expecting our second child. We had a couple of miscarriages before that. So, finally when Lev was born and then I remember those like sleepless nights when he couldn't sleep and he was crying and crying and I was so exhausted. And for some point of time I was holding him and I like, but this is actually our life. This is like present happiness. We wanted this so much and we have And it doesn't matter like maybe now he's not sleeping and crying. But this is the life we want have. Can we enjoy it? Like bringing enjoyment disconnected from like ambitions every day it's very important and this is the only way to actually enjoy this life for me.

Mhm. Yeah, and yes, I agree to cut it to cut this I don't know rope between ambition and real like real lifetime moments is sometimes it's really really hard. I I feel that it's also some kind of a training like some kind of a trick that you need to do with your mind to remember yourself to remind yourself that yes, the sun is shining, that you can go to an ocean, real ocean that you are real you live close to an ocean. Oh my god, it was my dream. I was I was dreaming of becoming a marine biologist and to study dolphins. Now I'm here. Where am I and where are the dolphins?

yeah, so not to not to forget about it. Let's do that like this like small reminder to everyone who is watching this and to ourselves that we all had dreams. Small dreams, little dreams. Let's try to do something today, tomorrow to fulfill this like small dreams. For me was I really wanted to spend more time also on the ocean to meet like sunset or sunrises. So, let's do this. Let's do Let's do this more. Agreed. Like next weekend goal set up. If I'm not mistaken, you moved to the US while also being a young mother. Correct me if I'm wrong. And how did you manage to find your path and become in demand in a field with such a high barrier, I mean tech, to entry after such major transitions, motherhood and immigration. I ask because I'm in transition of my own and honestly I often feel quite lost.

Maybe we have to come through like this journey to really understand what what we need and what we like because for me it was very tough moment for sure. I I was 27. Sonia, our daughter, she was five. We moved here and at the time I was on O-3 visa. That visa did not allow me to work. So, and I'm I'm very active and ambitious ambition person. so, I and I tried to care so much for people around me. I spent I think even more time that I could could could could could actually do trying to help them. To my husband to build his career. So, I was We were building company together, but I was like on behind the scenes because I was not allowed to do this. I was so involved in like Sonia's activities, Sonia's life. I was But, I was I remember I was doing this like special I was preparing special theme weeks for her to like like to learn with her.

At some point of time, I lost myself completely. I every everything good that was happening in their life, I I I I I felt that it was their success. It was Sonia's success, it was Nick's success. If something went wrong, I felt responsible because I thought, "Okay, that's my mistake. I couldn't like properly help them in the process to avoid this failure and these mistakes." Moving here, it was a tough period for us as I mentioned like it was a time when like we tried different things on our work and some a lot of things didn't work out. I had couple of miscarriages and of course like for Sonia who moved here without like any English, it was also very hard time. I heard about Vipassanā and I thought, "That's an amazing thing. So, you can spend 10 days without anything, without anyone." And I thought that would be amazing for me to spend these 10 days completely silent and actually think what I can do better for them, not for me, but for them.

Mhm. Of course, I didn't I don't I didn't know anything about Vipassanā at the time about meditation. So, I it was very hard experience for me. I came out of it not completely different person, but with completely different understanding about the the whole experience. And I realized that when you when I lost myself, I actually I I I lost myself like I I could not see myself in in in in this like environment, and like what I'm doing, what I want. I realized that every time I we went to the restaurant, I couldn't even like order food for me because I I couldn't I couldn't tell what I want. That's a not right signal. and spending this 10 days thinking a lot about them, I realized that everyone should spend time with themselves as well. And my main question for me, for Nick, and for Sonya, well Sonya was still young but mostly for me and for Nick was but what we really want to do.

Not what is best for us, not is what what what what is best like to survive in this environment, but what we really want to do, what you love. And that changed completely our approach to work. So, we actually we dropped lots of projects which was like it was logical on the paper why we were doing this. and Nick focused on Masquerade actually. That was not obvious choice. It was at that time it was like very small app. And but he really loved working with guys. He really loved working on this idea. And I like and I spent more time with understanding what I want to do, what I how I want to be involved. My piece of advice just like try to find the time for yourself and ask all these questions to yourself and prioritize love and the love to in what you're doing, with whom you want to do this because for me most of the time it's not about what I want to do.

It's for me most of the times with whom I want to do. So, and how I want to do. Thank you so much. It's so it's It's such a great advertisement of Vipassana,

the link is going to be down below. yeah, so Vipassana companies, please contact me. I think I need to digest it a bit more and yeah. And what do you think? Is it really possible to build both a meaningful career and a family without constantly feeling guilt? And what's the recipe if it's one? If there is one. First of all, stop stop making labels of meaningful and successful because it's like everyone has different m- definition of meaningful and successful. And we all have different ways of understanding ourselves what is it. So, work if you want if you like working, work on what you love to do. Spend time in the way you love spending time with your family. Because you know what? Like I know I know parents who just hate playing like boring games with kids, but they like I don't know, watching films or reading together.

And then to stop like labeling this like perfect definition of like the perfect parent. If you have love in all these things, that's that's the solution, I think, for me personally. Maybe some kind of a very easy tool or your recommendation, how do you think AI can save women time and help make a career and family life more manageable? As you interact with AI tools, companies, topics a lot. You know what? I just before our talk what before our call with you, I have a call with one of our portfolio companies. It calls Aurora. And the main goal and like the biggest like North Star for this company is actually to build a product for women to accompany her with AI with different AI recipes, tools like to make women's life easier. I just

recommend to follow them because they have they're working on a lot of things. But in shortly now I'm looking at a lot of like we used to multitask a lot because we have to combine a lot of things. Now I'm looking at like I'm at at men around me who because of AI have to multitask more than they used to be and they're so frustrated about them. And then and I'm feeling like okay, finally you can feel just a little bit how we are feeling every day. And now actually I am feeling so much So because of we can like implement a lot of AI tools in our multitasking like journey a lot. Making it easier to operate like household or like follow all the emails not to lose like important like another important email from from school not to buy something. So for me AI is actually a huge time saver in my like daily life.

I don't think it's it Before that the question like okay like are you a full-time professional or are you a full-time mom was was was much harder choice. Now like with AI I understand that I can do more. Like focus on on on relationship finally more than on just like operational side of family household. Could you please share some tip that some AI tool, something that you implemented that help you to self to save time, something with emails or I don't know with ordering something? So, what what is it exactly?

Yeah, for example, like you can you can use Perplexity computer to like before that it was Perplexity assistant that can go through all your emails, categorize them, prepare drafts to I don't know, like this is from school, this is something you have to reply, and this is a draft for you. for example, like do not forget like to order pencils for for for for your child. And because it's a Perplexity browser, they already have my Amazon account, and then just with a click of a button can add it to my cart and like order for me. No

No No lots of like No not a problem. You can build a journey where, for example, I don't know, we have a nanny who is responsible for picking up a lab from school. And for example, yesterday she texted me that she couldn't do this. So, automatically it can reach either like granddad because he's here and text him, "Could you please do this?" Or like like that text this message is not only to me, but like to my husband and everyone else. Mhm. You can I don't know, you can optimize like now because we have like difficult schedules like with all the activities from my son's life my my son's life, from my daughter's life. you can implement all together and see if is there is a day when you can have a dinner together? And if you have a dinner together, like we have a a a special board, that digital board where like they can our kids can write, what like they're what they what they want.

Like for example, like for the next like family dinner we want and our chips and Coca-Cola for example, for what what they usually do. So, they can implement and order, on on our behalf as well. So, lots of different like small things because you know sometimes that the I think that's the power like of woman that we can have a lot of context when we're making decisions. So, for example, like we are scheduling a dentist visit on these days on these day because like my I don't know my work and at that time and I know that left want to have a playdate with that guy and, I know that the next day he will have very important like gymnastics class. I don't want him to feel like I don't know sore after the, appointment. So, probably the better day is not to schedule today but to have it like another So, we have a lot of context.

And now finally we can

upload it to AI. Mhm. And to help it schedule, more properly something, yeah? So, to to use it as a schedule a scheduler. Need to try something because I was trying to find, peace and balance and joy of life while doing some, things, like regular things. but I definitely think that checking on emails and answering emails and scheduling something it doesn't bring me any kind of joy. It's it's better for me to cook something or to even wash some, bottle for my daughter than, to go through emails and to order something on Amazon. Yeah, so it's it's not something that brings real joy. In one of your posts, you described so well that feeling of having a full life, full of work, conversation, and efficiency, and still feeling lonely, still feeling like you can never fully relax. Do you think that comes that things comes from Silicon Valley and the kind of people we surrounded ourselves with, from ambition itself, or simply from the time that we live in?

First of all, it's very common among founders all over the world. There's like a lot of like statistics and a lot of like research about that. And my last TED Talk was about loneliness among founders. That's because mostly people always have to project something, project success among the investors, among the employees, among the customers. What what actually you're doing? You are always wearing a mask. So you're disconnecting your real feelings with what we are projecting to the world. It's very common among founders because they have to do this like to raise money, but it's very general for all people as well. I had a talk with my friend who like has I don't know I I want her friends one of the most successful founders in the world. They around like they have people around them like Elon Musk, I don't know, Sergey Brin. They have people around them all of the day.

But you know what? They feel very lonely as well. Because it's not about like how many people you have around. It's about how many people you have with whom you connect without your mask projecting something. Maybe that's why like intuitively I'm always building communities in whatever I'm doing like doesn't matter it's a book club or venture capital fund because I really believe that having your tribe, your community where you can be honest and with like with whom you can with people you can trust and be yourself. It's very important. Loneliness it's it's it's it's a big problem right now, but I I I I'm always telling like just find find at least one person, at least one person with whom you can be absolutely transparent, with whom you can talk daily and share all your vulnerability. At least one. If you have a community of people who are going through similar processes like I don't know, founders community or like moms community.

It's very important. Just find your tribe because we evolved in tribes with whom we can share vulnerabilities. So, I will share my vulnerability right now. So, I moved here when I was 32. And I feel very attached to deep relationships with my family and with my old friends. only with them I do truly feel that I do not to have to be anyone to wear mask there is no particular order to be loved. And I would love to feel the same level of closeness with people here. Do you think that it's possible? In my experience, it's possible because I have You know what? You have to have a little bit more courage and do the first step yourself. The problem is that like why we are not doing this anyway I for me it took some time as well to have this like trust strategy as like as as your like strategy in life.

could be very like frustrating. You can be very it could be very scary because you will definitely have some people who will break your trust. Mhm. But you will have many more people who will stand with you, who will support you, and who who will become your tribe. And that's the only one thing that is matter. So, be ready that you can be screwed up in the process, but on the way you will definitely find your people here. Thank you. And oh boy, you you mentioned that you love to create communities and recently you started organizing TEDx. Could you tell the audience what that means to you and why do you decided to take it on? Yeah, my journey with TEDx was not very obvious, I would say. I I've never had a dream to speak on that. So, I know people like my my husband, that's his dream.

He's an excellent public speaker. He I'm pretty sure that when he will be speaking on that that stage, that would be the most epic TED Talk ever. that was his dream. It was never my dream. I've never wanted to be a TEDx speaker. But somehow I've I've been invited to do a TEDx Talk a couple of years ago. And when I Of course, I have a lot of like concerns. Why me? What I'm going to say? I'm not that good in public speaking. But I I have this feeling that I have to trust the journey. If it somehow comes to me, I have I guess I have to try. So, I went through that experience and I It was a hard experience when you especially when you're like with piece of paper and you have to work on your TED Talk and share the most im- one of the most important thing you want to share with the world.

It's very hard. But I enjoyed the process a lot. Mhm. and when I was going for the process, I thought, you know what? I want to give this journey I I want to give this experience to other people as well. I know like some people I want them to give like this TEDx experience, TEDx stage to share their valuable moments, their valuable things, things they want to they they can share. Maybe Yeah, I think that that's a Julie who invited me to to my TED TEDx first TEDx talk. that's all because of her because she she filled the experience with so much sense and so much care. like with lots of small details. Like I I I I remember I came to Armenia and we had this absolutely amazing rehearsal with other speakers. I like the whole like community were supporting. so the whole experience was was was amazing.

So I I I had this feeling myself that I really want to bring the same experience to other speakers. That's why I applied to to TEDx to get the license. And in December we did our first TEDx TEDx event. and actually it was very epic because like on I I just came from Vancouver where they have the main TED TED event. And I was approached by TEDx organizers like global team and they approached me and said, "We just want to see the person who got 100% satisfactory score from feedback from the audience because everyone like left amazing feedback on the event. It was they subscribed to our Instagram page. They were following all of our like photos that it was very beautiful. And they were forcing us actually to get a next license to do a next experience. So, probably during the fall, we will have another one.

Ooh, finally I will have the opportunity to become a volunteer. Yeah, because it was really amazing, really inspiring and like it was my 39th week of pregnancy and the it I I remembered it very well. Yeah, so thank you for for for bringing it to this area and I'm pretty sure that it's going to be like awesome next time. yeah, so my very last question is we we briefly talked about it, but maybe you can share some tips and I don't know some thoughts. how do you understand, what do you truly want and who do you really want to become in the future? Well, first of all, let's just try lots of things and accept that you will make lots of mistakes on the way, which is very hard most of the women because we want to be perfect. We we we are very afraid of making mistakes and I think that's one of the reason why we have less female founders that we could have.

So, we have a lot like lots of responsibility on our on our on on us and I I really want us to feel more to make more mistakes because this is a journey to learn what is actually for you and to try a lot of things, try a lot of hypotheses. Yeah, and that's for me I'm what I'm doing right now, I really enjoy doing it. I'm not sure that like in five I'm sure that I in some way I will be do doing the similar things, but maybe from different angle, from different perspective, from I don't know different sense. I'm not sure. And it's okay. that's That's the beauty of life. Period. Thank you, Marina. Thank you for coming. It was a wonderful conversation and yeah. I'm so happy that we finally did it.